GARDEN TOKYO presents
MSML SPECIAL INTERVIEW
How bandsmen create clothes that are “the real thing”
Loud rock pioneers take on the heights of the apparel industry
These days, clothing brands are no longer created only by people from the fashion world who graduated from fashion schools. We’re seeing a flourishing of brands launched by models, stylists, J.Leaguers, influencers, rappers, and adult film actresses. New brands keep appearing based on the simple marketing logic that “the number of social media followers equals the number of customers.” In this landscape, there are almost no precedents of active rock musicians creating a brand that offers authentic clothing. And if they’ve also managed to excel professionally in two fields, they may be the first ever. Taking on this formidable challenge is MSML (pronounced “em-es-em-el”). T$UYO$HI (PTP, The BONEZ, Dragon Ash) and KATSUMA (coldrain) have earned mainstream recognition in the world of so-called loud rock - extreme rock, in other words - and risen to become leading figures in Japan. Alongside them, KOJI, vocalist for SCREAMING SOUL HILL, pioneers of the extreme rock scene, who is now also involved in the creative work at THE CRIMIE, brings a new world to life with the other two that delivers an exceptionally high level of performance, beyond anything we’ve seen before. Like musicians creating songs, their ability to influence people by sharing things they themselves believe are good is immeasurable. So we sat down with the three directors for an interview about their current views on the brand and their roots.
We learned a lot from having the two of them actually wear the clothes onstage and give us feedback （KOJI）
----First, could you tell us about your favorite items from MSML’s 24SS collection?
KATSUMA (hereafter K): Personally, I like the faux-leather shorts. I just like them. You can’t really layer much in summer, right? But if you wear those, pretty much anything you put on top works.
T$UYO$HI (hereafter T): The first thing that comes to mind is the T-shirt with the large print of The Last Supper. Ever since the pandemic, we’re no longer in an era when you go to a clothing store, try things on, and buy them. You just take a quick look online and buy something, so I think it’s a problem if it doesn’t have any individuality. In that situation, you look for something different from everything else. If other brands are selling the same thing, you have to think about which one to choose, but I think making something nobody else has is best.
KOJI (hereafter KJ): That T-shirt, like the all-over print shirt, is something I’ve never seen before, with the print covering the bottom half. I think it’s distinctive and great.
----What goes into deciding a season’s theme?
T： I think it was decided mainly by Ko-chan.
KJ： In the end, I made the final decision myself after talking with the two of them, but the theme for this collection emerged from all sorts of ideas.
----Were there any movies you watched, music you listened to, or photo books you looked at while creating the clothes?
KJ : I think I was watching the film “BAGDAD CAFÉ” (Japanese title: “Bagdad Café”). Music-wise, Blankey, Radiohead, Nirvana, and so on.
K： In the end, what my favorite artists wear might be the basis for it.
----When you say the things your favorite artists wore, do you mean something like “that piece in that artist photo”?
K： Absolutely. I first got interested in clothes because the things my favorite artists wore looked cool. Wanting to be like them was where it all started.
KJ： One of the reasons MSML got started in the first place was that KATSUMA liked T$UYO$HI’s fashion.
----T$UYO$HI, your clothes don’t look like costumes, do they? Musicians used to have that stage-costume look.
T： I don’t like that. When I was around junior high school age, I wanted to be something out of the ordinary. But perms and delinquent fashion didn’t appeal to me. Then I discovered what are now called visual kei bands, and thought, “Whoa! There are people this cool!” But a few years later, it was like they’d wear tracksuits normally, then put on costumes and makeup to transform when they went onstage.
I thought it was cool to become someone you couldn’t be in everyday life, but it didn’t feel quite right. When bands like Blankey started appearing, I shifted toward thinking, “Wait, it’s better to look cool in everyday life.”
----Still, T$UYO$HI seems to have a more naturally cool style.
T： Well, I do give it some thought when it comes to what I wear onstage. But in a way, stage outfits have more restrictions. Like, rappers sometimes come out onstage wearing down jackets, right?
But if you’re carrying an instrument, you can’t wear that. You might throw something on and think, “Oh, this looks great,” but you also have to consider whether it looks good with your instrument.
----Do you have any stories that show MSML’s attention to detail in how you make clothes?
KJ： T$UYO$HI and I talk a lot about “keeping cool.” We consider how easy something is to move around in, and how even if it looks cool, you might not be able to wear it if it’s too hot. So we may put a lot of thought into outerwear during the planning stage.
T： Another thing Ko-chan and I were particular about was shirts. There was a period when it became a trend to wear patterned shirts onstage. The more expensive the shirt, the more wrinkled it got. But we don't take them to the cleaners every time; we quickly wash them that day, and since we have another show the next day, we wear them again. So I don't like materials that get really wrinkled. That's something we're particular about. More expensive materials aren't necessarily better.
KJ： We learned a lot from the feedback the two of them gave after actually wearing the clothes onstage. But that's not all there is to it now. We've also started choosing materials according to the phase we're in. After going through all that, we've reached a point where we can make things with a sense of what works now.
We're rock musicians, and we have the punk DIY spirit, too （KATSUMA）
----This is a bit of a tangent, but do you two, T$UYO$HI and KATSUMA, have personal stylists?
T： We've never had anyone.
K： We don't have anyone dedicated to that.
----I imagine it must be hard to manage your stage outfits yourselves.
K： We're rock musicians to begin with, and we have the punk DIY spirit, too. Painting on a biker jacket yourself and cutting it up isn't that different.
T： Of course, after a show, if you leave everything together, the staff will wash it for you. But I don't put mine in because I don't want it to shrink. So even when they ask what to do, I say, “It's fine” (and turn them down). If I wash it in water at the hotel and hang it in the room, it helps keep the room from getting too dry. It helps keep my throat from getting irritated, so it works well.
K： Still, leather is a pain (wry smile).
T： That's true (laughs).
----But you don't really have a leather-jacket image, T$UYO$HI, do you? (laughs)
KJ： No, no, he wears it in his private life.
T： I can't move in it when I'm playing live. I've always loved leather and denim, but they're the kind of clothes I can't wear onstage.
----Meanwhile, KATSUMA wears leather all year round, right?
K： I want to wear leather as much as possible because it looks cool (laughs). It's a classic men's item, and there's that association of rock with leather.
----How can you play drums in a leather jacket?
K： It's seriously hard to play in (wry smile). (Pointing around his shoulder blades) I can't move this area, so Lewis Leathers won't work. Actually, cowhide in general is impossible. It's too stiff to move in. Sheepskin or lambskin works.
----I see (laughs). What do you do when it gets sweaty?
K： I let it dry first, then spray it with the strongest Resesh, and keep going (laughs). For a long-set show, I come out wearing the leather jacket at first, right? If the set is around 20 songs, I take it off around the tenth song. Then it feels like taking off a battle suit in Dragon Ball, like “whoosh!” My body feels unbelievably light (laughs).
----It's amazing that it doesn't get in the way of playing.
K： It gets in the way a lot (laughs). That's why I've put a lot of thought into the leather jackets we make at MSML. I actually wear them onstage, too. They're made from sheepskin, and the leather is finished quite thin.
Without dividing the editions, the three directors have come together to enter a new phase （T$UYO$HI）
----Let me change the subject. Are you planning to do collections and runway shows in the future?
KJ： Yes. We've grown with two pillars, the T$UYO$HI Edition and the KATSUMA Edition, and in terms of the scene, we've been doing streetwear. Then, around the last couple of seasons, we also saw a pattern where only each edition's own followers would buy it. We want to become a proper brand, so we decided to bring MSML together as one. It's still a challenge, though.
The challenge is figuring out how to build the brand while keeping what makes them who they are. We're working on it, going back and forth about what to do. They're performers with real showmanship onstage.
The BONEZ's SUNTOWN at the Arena, Gaishi Hall, and Makuhari Messe, as well as coldrain's BLARE FEST. They're putting on incredible shows and succeeding on the front lines, so it's time for the brand to step up as well. That's what we're aiming for, and we have to elevate the brand.
T： I want to put out the fact that the editions that used to be separate have now come together as one. After everything that's happened, the three directors have joined forces without separating the editions, and the brand is entering a new phase. I want to get that message across.
----What kind of brand do you want to make MSML?
KJ： I want our clothes to have a bit of a rebellious edge and be appealing. I want people to wear what we make and be blown away. Simply put, I want to inspire people to feel, “That’s so cool!”
T： I guess I want to make clothes people want to buy. Even I can clearly tell the difference between clothes I just look at and clothes I actually buy. In that sense, I want to make clothes people will want to buy.
K： First of all, just like with making music, we want to create and put out things that we think are cool. Rather than being swayed by everyone's opinions, we want to stick to our own values without compromising them.
From the left
T$UYO$HI
（PTP、The BONEZ、Dragon Ash）
KOJI
KATSUMA
（coldrain）
